in pain

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in pain

Postby janef61 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:03 pm

I am new to this forum so please forgive me if I post on too many topics, its just so good to find a place where I can talk and other people might understand.
I feel very upset and dont know where to turn at the moment.
My daughter of 15 is now communicating with her birth family on facebook. I do occasionally log in to see whats been said and exchanged.
I know my daughter needs to know her family, she has 2 siblings still living with parents, and there seems to be a lot of love and kisses and hugs exhanged between them.
I think most of it is written by birth mum, (although my daughter was taken away for emotional abuse.)
Someone tell me how I stop feeling the jealously and hurt, and also feeling excluded as she dosent want to discuss any of this with me. We have been through so much to adopt her. I just dont know what the future holds ,its so difficult
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Postby ladyarcher » Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:04 pm

Fifteen, as I am sure I do not need to tell you, is a very awkward age. Not only is the 'child' nearly grown up in her own eyes, but also, as a girl, she will still be having ongoing 'growing up hormones' whizzing about.

As an adoptee myself, albeit a very aged one now, I can totally empathise with your daughter in not wanting to share her thoughts and experiences of her 'new/old' family with you. I can remember the feeling very well myself, although I was a lot older when I got in contact with my birth mother - and eventually many other relatives. I simply could not envisage being with two mothers at the same time. I was one daughter to my adoptive mother.........and did not, to start with, have any idea of what sort of daughter I was to my birth mother. I did not know how she would want to relate to me, nor how or even if, I would want to relate to her.

I viewed my adoptive mother's insistance on wanting to know what was happening, and what my b.mother was like, as intrusive, and simply not her business. In fact I never did let them meet, and kept the two bits of my life separate. I was 25 when I first started serious searching, and 27, when I found my b.mother........and then had ongoing contact until my b.mother died when I was 43. I was happy, once I got to know her a bit, to have her visit and meet her 5 grandchildren, also we visited her......but this was simply not spoken of to my a.mother. (My a.father had died some years before, and did not even live to see the three children of my second marriage sadly).

I think that the more you 'want to know' the less you will get told. Very difficult I know, but try to play it totally 'cool'. If your daughter does mention anything, just say something like 'that's nice dear...........' and change the subject. Its a bit reverse psychology, and it may not work, but whether it does or not, at least it should not lead to arguments.

As she is not eighteen yet, how is that she has contact, or has it always been a sort of open adoption........if she has access to her file, at some time, she will surely find out about the emotional abuse, and will want some answers from her b.mother about it.

Also, I would not be too concerned about the (((((hugs))))) and XXXXXs that you see on Facebook. I think that these things are scattered about quite liberally on all those sorts of sites.......even on this one too, and I do it myself........its not that it is meaningless, it is a way of showing sympathy/interest/concern/ etc. which you cannot do with your tone of voice, or facial expression of course, when typing, or even worse, texting.

So.....(((((((hugs))))))))in sympathy, from me, for your present worry....

LA
born 1944 - adopted 1946
found birth mother 1972, and many others over the years since.
Finally found full sister this year, after a 40 year search.
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Postby lilit » Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:56 pm

This must be so difficult for you. Have you contacted After Adoption to see if they can put you in touch with someone to give you some help? I think it's really important for you to have a safe place to talk about how this makes you feel, completely separate from your daughter.
I'm much older than your daughter and only recently made contact with my birth family, but I do find it hurtful that my adoptive mother seems to find it necessary to be a tiny bit dismissive about them - I know it's only because she feels (needlessly) threatened but it still hurts.
It's not fair, but I think as an adoptive parent you have to be "selfless" and not let on to your daughter how hard it is for you. She is almost certainly conflicted on some level and I don't think at 15 she is old enough to deal with the guilt she'd feel if she thought you were suffering as a result of her making contact with birth family.
If you have someone to talk honestly with (a counsellor? an adoption support group?) about your own feelings, it'll be easier to put them aside when you talk with your daughter about her adoption - hopefully if you can get some support you'll be able to be there for her when she has to tackle the issue of why she was removed in the first place. You sound like a loving mum and I wish you all the best, 15 is a bad enough age as it is without having all this to deal with!
Best of luck!
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Re: in pain

Postby Mina » Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:56 pm

janef61 wrote:I am new to this forum so please forgive me if I post on too many topics, its just so good to find a place where I can talk and other people might understand.
I feel very upset and dont know where to turn at the moment.
My daughter of 15 is now communicating with her birth family on facebook. I do occasionally log in to see whats been said and exchanged.
I know my daughter needs to know her family, she has 2 siblings still living with parents, and there seems to be a lot of love and kisses and hugs exhanged between them.
I think most of it is written by birth mum, (although my daughter was taken away for emotional abuse.)
Someone tell me how I stop feeling the jealously and hurt, and also feeling excluded as she dosent want to discuss any of this with me. We have been through so much to adopt her. I just dont know what the future holds ,its so difficult



Jane, we were told that we were nuts when we fuaght to get our adopted son to have direct contact with his birth family. He is 12 now and he started contact 2 years ago. The aim was to help him to find his identity and also to address his loss issues. My son too has siblings that live with his b. mother. This is more difficult for our children.

If you take the view that this is therapy for her and help her heal, I think it would help. Read some of the publications from British Society of Adoption and Fostering. It is very informative. Maybe she would like to have direct contact with her bm. My son had put this woman on a pedastal. After a sleepover at her house (long story!), he realised what a crap mum she is and how caring I am! It is part of their 'condition' to think that their bm is wonderful. Read up attachment disorder. This will expalin to you why and how they feel.
good luck
M
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Postby j-h-g-5 » Wed Dec 02, 2009 7:52 pm

I think it is important to remember not to generalise. Not all birth relations are 'crap' - so it would be wrong to assume that in every single case.

It may well be a condition / part of attachment disorder for some to place their birth relation on a pedestal, but in many many cases the very opposite is true for a wide variety of reasons.

Believe it or not, some are pleasantly surprised to find out that their birth relation doesn't measure up to the demonised image that is sometimes expected.
Please join us on FACEBOOK, helping people affected by adoption & showing your support:
www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=10718147812
or use the After Adoption message system to send a PM.
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Postby Mina » Thu Dec 03, 2009 7:18 am

j-h-g-5 wrote:I think it is important to remember not to generalise. Not all birth relations are 'crap' - so it would be wrong to assume that in every single case.

It may well be a condition / part of attachment disorder for some to place their birth relation on a pedestal, but in many many cases the very opposite is true for a wide variety of reasons.

Believe it or not, some are pleasantly surprised to find out that their birth relation doesn't measure up to the demonised image that is sometimes expected.


I quite agree, not all bm are crap. Many adoptees are falsley taken from them. But in my sons case, she had three kids taken away in one foul swoop. Her head will be pretty messed up. The adoptive mums, however, have to deal with the deep seated anger a adoted child with RAD feels. They direct this anger at the adoptive mother. Life is not easy with them. They blame everything on the adoptive mothers. I have never demonised his mother. Infact I think it is up to them to get to know them and make their own minds up.

It is their basic human right that they should be allowed to do this. Life is even harder for them.

When my son came back from his sleep over, he realised that I was not the demon HE made me out to be.
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Postby alabasium » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:39 pm

Yes indeed! A therapist recently said to me that adoptive mothers get the sting in the tail.
The a dad might be 12 V but the a mum will get the full 240V! He said this is because of the maternal archetype and that an adopted child is often using the adoptive mum as someone to project their hurt on to re: their birth parent.

I have experience of both sides of the fence so can see both sides! I agree with the above.
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Postby Mina » Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:10 pm

alabasium wrote:Yes indeed! A therapist recently said to me that adoptive mothers get the sting in the tail.
The a dad might be 12 V but the a mum will get the full 240V! He said this is because of the maternal archetype and that an adopted child is often using the adoptive mum as someone to project their hurt on to re: their birth parent.

I have experience of both sides of the fence so can see both sides! I agree with the above.


You are lucky to have a therapist who understands this. There is such a lack of understanding of the mental health issues involved in adoption, and this just among the professionals in adoption! The general public think that every child has been taken away from abusive parents and now they are placed with a wonderful adoptive family and everyone lives happily ever after!

there is abuse in adoptive families too I am sure, especially when they dont understand about the attachment issues these children suffer, not to mention anger, loss, grief etc.

In my sons case the most emotional abuse he has suffered has been in the hands of social workers who go around applying their procederes without even understanding some of the basic child development. His bm had post natal depression. So bless them, they took three of her kids away and left her in pieces. She had treatemnt and recovered and had three more children. But they stopped all direct contact with my son because thats the procedure for adopted children! He had letter box contact but it is a bit hard for a three year old to hug a letter!

These children's human rights are being abused right left and centre. I wish more adoptive parents would stop listening to their social workers advice. A lot of lies have been told to keep their costs down. You can get decent advice from BAAF. I wont give our local ss the time of day. Their lies has meant that my son did not get the right therapy at an early age and therfore his chances of getting a better outcome have been damaged.
He is approaching teen now is finding it difficult to cope. He is self harming, among other things and this is difficult to watch. I know he will never reach his full potential because of what the system has done to him.

Does anyone know any good lawyers who could help my son sue these people, they seem to think they are above the law and they carry on doing this to others.

M
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Postby ladyarcher » Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:30 pm

I think most people would be pretty nervous about recommending a solicitor..........their input can be pretty dodgy as I know to my cost when trying to get help about access for my ex after our divorce......not quite the same I know, but two confused small boys to deal with, and yes, the effects are long term too........they are now in their forties.
There is a solicitor who is on the internet, I will try to find his name, I think I have it saved somewhere.........he particularly advertises as helping over children who the soc.serv. have removed inappropriately, which would seem to be the case with the poor girl with post natal depression. Not sure if I can find the ad. again, but will try.
LA
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Postby Mina » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:28 pm

[quote="ladyarcher"]I think most people would be pretty nervous about recommending a solicitor..........their input can be pretty dodgy as I know to my cost when trying to get help about access for my ex after our divorce......not quite the same I know, but two confused small boys to deal with, and yes, the effects are long term too........they are now in their forties.
There is a solicitor who is on the internet, I will try to find his name, I think I have it saved somewhere.........he particularly advertises as helping over children who the soc.serv. have removed inappropriately, which would seem to be the case with the poor girl with post natal depression. Not sure if I can find the ad. again, but will try.
LA[/quote

Thanks, would appreciate it. I have seen a couple of solicitors and phoned a few. They dont want to know. their advice has been to let it go as I probably wou;ldnt get very far. What age are we living in? Child protection service and adoption are very closley linkinked and both systems are draconian. These children are being damaged by the system and I cannot let it go!]
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Postby ladyarcher » Thu Dec 03, 2009 11:34 pm

Mima - I am sending you a private message
LA
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