Athensrunners Blog

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Athensrunners Blog

Postby cleo » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:42 am

Hi Athensrunner, and to everyone else...hello

I have just read your blog page, like me your son was born in january, my son just turn't 34..... i have exactly the same feelings, do i regret giving him up, Yes......and No

At the time i thought i was doing the right thing, and deep down i still think i did the right thing, now knowing how he has a wonderful lifestyle and great A.Parents he could ever wish for, his words. In that sense i made the right choice, i know not all adoptee's have the same 'happy' outcome.

I could never, and still not give him all he has now..material wise i mean...all i have is the love i feel for a child, my first born.

Its not easy being told that he wants nothing to do with me, but i have accepted this now, like i said after 4 years of raw hurt. This month i did not get upset or fall into a depressed wreck...i told myself that, 'we were just never mean,t to be in each other lives'........i have to accept it and carry on in some way.

How do i carry on? Goodness knows, i take each day as it comes, try to make my life happy, like before...but its hard, i have taken a serious knocking, self esteem gone out the window, my trust in people (which was already low) is near in-existant. I just put all my energy in my dogs now, and of course my husband. I have never talked to him again about my son, nearly a year and a half now.

Another question i ask myself and wonder about other B.mumls who have been in reunion, and failed.....do you regret meeting up? No....and Yes

No, because i know that the choice i made was what i wanted for him, to have the best in life, which his has got!!!!

Yes, because when i knew nothing about him, i could only speculate the sort of life he has, when it came to birthdays or christmas etc, i would think about him all day wondering what he'd be upto, but then, because i knew nothing, the pain would subside. But now i know about him and that he also has 2 boys, when birthdays etc come around i feel shallow and lonely and hurt, in a way i cannot really describe because its just a deep hurt inside of me......i think of them and hope to get a glimpse on one of his social pages, but nothing...........he posts about his new flashy car to his mates or work wise, but thats not often. He posted a photo of himself and his son about 8 months ago, its always nice to see, don't get me wrong...

But my feelings for him have changed, its not that i don't love him, i do with all my heart, but the hurt i feel as the years go by are just to sad. I never asked for anything from him except to meet up when he had time, and now matter how many times i go over it....i still feel it was not much to ask.....as i do not live in the uk, so its not as if i want to see him every five minutes.

Anyway i'm ranting on again, i know it takes a little weight off my heavy heart, but i should'nt go on about it......Athens i hope one day that you'll have the chance to finally get to meet your son 'properly', you are incredibly patient, i can only wish you all the best for when that day arrives, and hope with all my heart that he accepts you for who you are.



Yr
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby ladyarcher70 » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:02 pm

So sad for you Cleo ...... and Athens ....... so near yet so far, for both of you ..... it is a bereavement without a grave to visit ........ sorry for that particular analogy, we have just been to a funeral today......now that is five of my friends who have lost their husbands in the last four years ..... 2 to 'hearts', and 2 to the big C ...... and 1 to an unheard of combination of medical coincidences.

Today's funeral was for my younger daughter's father in law ........ a fit and energetic farmer in his early 70s, who had retired from farming six years ago, but continued working in outdoor jobs, but without the stress of running the farm. Non smoker, only very occasional glass of wine on an 'occasion' ......rest in peace John Gelli ..

.... service was totally in Welsh, but sort of understandable, which was odd. Nearly everyone there was Welsh first language ...... a large close family with all the aunts, uncles, cousins, second cousins etc....... as well as many friends and neighbours in that comfortingly close Welsh speaking community..

..seeing our 14 year old grandson comforting his father and his Welsh Mam-gi ........ and seeing his little sister,
our tiny 18 month old grandaughter.... running round being acknowledged by pats and kisses and conversations with all these people who she had never seen before, but with whom they share a bloodline ...... brought back to me, - not that it ever leaves me, - the tremendous importance of blood family ....... the feeling cannot be dismissed or denied ...... some of us are lucky in our connection with our children and grandchildren, I am ........ I am lucky too, in my tracing and acceptance in my 'first' family ..... not all adoptees get the easy comfortable relationship I have with my Canadian father's family ....

(...sadly the full sister I searched for, for so long, is keeping a distance atm...... but that's another story .....)

Cleo...... my offer still stands, to speak to him if you wanted.....
AthensR...... hugs as usual, nothing practical I can do for you, but you know you are always in my thoughts ....

LA
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby athensrunner » Thu Feb 04, 2016 9:36 pm

Hi there just to let you know I'm survived January...my son's birthday and my wedding anniversary...normally January means a big black hole for me...this year because of some changes in my work situation, I survived....and for once I felt able to reach out to people rather than bottling it up.

Cleo...sent you a pm
LadyA...as always so true

For everyone else.celebrate those who are departed (by death or other means)....make sure they are remembered for how you remember them...our loved ones will prefer us celebrating their life rather than commiserating their life, just don't bottle it up...I have spent too long bottling up my feelings...I thought I had stopped but over the past few months I have realised i had not....just always be open and honest about those who are not with us..they (and you) would appreciate it more.
Birth mother in an international adoption

Feel free to read my ramblings as a birth mother
http://www.athensrunner.blogspot.com
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby cleo » Fri Feb 05, 2016 4:59 pm

Evening Athens and LA

Lovely to read that you are doing fine athens, it was nice to read your blog

LA thankyou again but i think i will let sleeping dogs lie, where my son is concerned, although i do have a question....his A.dad has now been dead for 5 years now...would this mean that i can ask for his death certificate as it will be 'publicly' opened, if you see what i mean.

I did go to the local registrar office when i first heard he had died, but they would'nt give me details because it was too soon, and i think they said it was a 5 year wait before records were made public?!!
Can you enlighten me in someway? Will i be able to find out where his a.dad is buried?

Thankyou
cleo
 
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby sylvie 1 » Wed Feb 24, 2016 12:01 pm

Cleo, I think asking for your son's dad's death certificate might feel very intrusive to your son. I don't know for sure, of course, but I imagine it would. I personally would not involve myself in my son's adoptive family's personal business unless invited, just as I would never involve myself in any other family's personal business unless invited.
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby ladyarcher70 » Wed Feb 24, 2016 8:45 pm

Not absolutely sure about this, Cleo, but I think that all these certificates, birth, death and marriage, are a matter of official public record....... in the sense that you can apply for them, from Kew, and I would think that the request would not be known about by other relatives...

...I know that I have applied for birth certs. from Kew, and also my birth mother's marriage cert. from the registry office where she was married ......... this was her second marriage, and she was still alive then, and when I found her she had no idea that anyone could apply for a copy of her certificate.........also, in none of the applications did I have to prove who I was, or why I wanted the cert...... things may be different now, because the whole confidentiality thing is a bit different due to the internet mainly ......... I'm sure a phone call to the Records Office at Kew would tell you what is available and how to apply for it......

Anyone can also get copies of Wills apparently........I keep meaning to do this for my husband's grandfather, but we haven't been pursuing his tree lately as we are always so busy with gr.children etc...gr.father died when my husband was only six years old, and there has always been a slight mystery about the farm that he seemed to own, and the reason he was buried in a certain place nowhere near other family graves, and where he didn't seem to have any connections....

LA.....
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby cleo » Tue Mar 08, 2016 4:53 pm

Hi sylvie and La and athens

Sylvie i know what you mean about being intrusive, but it was just to find out if it was possible to know where he was buried, as for some reason i would like to go and thank him for everything he did, without anybody knowing i had gone to the burial sight of course. I know his A.dad's name and surname, but nobody could give me any information about where he was buried and just said i'd have to wait 5 years until made public or call or email all the cemeteries where i think he may of been buried, which i did do, but to no avail.

So just wondered if by requesting his death certificate, if it would be written on there. i do not know how things are done in the uk.

On another note about being intrusive, i always find it weird that an adoptee can gain information about the birth parents and turn their world upside down and yet when it comes to the birth parents they are allowed no info whatsoever, i am lucky that from the very beginning i told my husband about the existence of my son, never knowing if he would contact me one day, I cannot imagine 30+ years on having to explain to my husband about him.

Even with him knowing, it did rock our marriage a little when my son said he wanted no further contact with me, my husband told me that i would get hurt but i did not want to listen. I do tread very carefully with everyone now, sadly not trusting anyone either. I would never tell anyone if i did find his A.dad's resting place.

LA: a weird thing happened not long ago, my youngest sister and her husband have decided to foster children, and had social worker around their home to check out stuff and go into their backgrounds etc, my mum told me this and for the first time in 34years i asked my mum if the SS would go into my background too, meaning that my youngest sister would find out!! She was about 8 years old at the time and not sure if she'd know or remember anything. Anyway i anxiously asked my mum if they would dig out my past too, and she replied ' we have never ever spoken of your pregnancy ever since we knew, even after the birth and adoption, no questions were asked by my brother or sisters at the time, and thats how it has stayed'. I just felt so numb and a deep sadness inside of me, knowing even today, being the eldest i dissapointed my parents and let them down in a way by getting pregnant at such a young age. This never should of happened...but it did.

I never continued the conversation with my mum, i left it at that, i know my dad has never really forgiven me. Thats the reason i left the country too, it was easier for everyone - or so i thought at the time.

There are days i think i should talk to my mum about what went on, and hope that she can give some more answers to questions i think about, because i cannot remember everything, but i know my dad would not be happy, so i keep quiet and (pretend) everything is fine with me. There are days when i reflect on my life i think 'was i really that bad a person to be punished like this?' Because i got pregnant at such a young age and had a baby adopted, how is it possible to carry on as if nothing ever happened? How is it possible that after 30 years,to contact a person after so long then stopand act 'as if none of this ever happened?

I watched philomena again because it was on BBC2 not long ago, and all the lies and the hurt. The wanting to know what he talked liked what his interests were, little things that in fact mean so much.

Sadly my son has'nt posted for a very long time and no news on his son's or photos, i know he has changed companies and his job since a few months but thats all. Ah well, time is going by and like turtle has said, we have done nothing wrong, it the other side that have decided they want no contact with us, at least whatever happens we tried.

Take care everyone and thanks just for being there x
cleo
 
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby sylvie 1 » Wed Mar 09, 2016 2:01 pm

Hello Cleo

I had my son at 16 too. My parents, who were divorced, behaved in different ways to my pregnancy and also to my reunion.
These reactions can be summarised as abandonment, pressure, and guilt.

However, while my parents might have preferred to hold the corner of a rug up and sweep my motherhood and my son's existence under it, I decided I never would.

I have always talked about my son, always acknowledged his existence, and his importance to me.
At my wedding, he sat right by my side - he on my right, my new husband on my left.

I've been aware that my parents have a range of difficult feelings about the adoption of my son but frankly, that is their stuff, not mine.
It has been enough of a hard time, as I'm sure you know, to continue life without my own child since I was sixteen. To not know for decades if my son was alive or dead. To not know if I would ever see him again.
I decided a few years ago that looking after my parents' guilt was not my burden to carry too. They are adults, they can find any help they need. I am always open to talking about anything with them, or listening to them, but I'm not prepared to look after their feelings any more at the expense of my own, or my son's.

It saddens me greatly that you are so alone with your experience.
I wonder if you can talk to your sister now, as adult sisters.
It felt very empowering to me to acknowledge that having my son was the most profound and important thing that ever happened to me, and changed my life forever, and no-one was going to make me pretend such a momentous event and person had never happened.

Maybe that's just me. Maybe I'm wrong to think and act in this way. Maybe this bolshy part of my character is hurtful and mean.

But I am not ashamed of my son and never have been. I am proud of him.
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby cleo » Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:15 pm

Evening Sylvie,

Sadly like i said, all these years now nobody has said a thing about since the day they found out i was pregnant. They did not lift up a corner of the rug, but looking back now, it was the whole rug and down the cellar treatment.

I have 2 younger sisters one is 2 years younger than me and my youngest sister is 8 years younger. And a brother than is a year younger than me. I'm not sure what my brother or sister knows or remembers but certain that my youngest sister had no idea of what went on. I have never talked to them about it, back then or through the years, and like you, because i did not know if i'd ever see my son again and made to believe he was in another part of the country and told that through no circumstances was i ever to try and go looking for him. If the A.parents wanted him to know then it was upto them and if not then he would live a life without knowing too.

My parents made it clear that if any of us girls got pregnant, it was out the door!! Yet we were never told about the birds and the bee's either (so to speak) I do not know about my parents feelings, but i guess really that it was better to hide the fact and then decide that it would be better if i tried to get a job abroad....looking back now its like...out of sight out of mind. Gosh....to be honest i have never questioned my parents ways before my son came looking for me, as i had gotten on with my life as best i could, but always knowing a part of me was missing.

But now, what i went through at such a young age, moving to a new country, a new language, not seeing my family in the first year and a half, because i could'nt afford to come back every so often. I lost my family, my friends, my sports which i loved and was good at...i gave it all up, but the most important thing was giving up my son, how on earth do i come to terms with that? I still cannot answer this question.

Its not the fact that i want to spare my parents feelings, its more of sparing my feelings, what if they reject what i have to say, they have never accepted that i have a son. I have thought that if my dad dies before my mum then i might talk to her, because i can remember her vaguely being by my side when i went into labour, my dad drove me to the hospital and then left and came to pick me up several days later because we had alot of snow that year, and the day i was due to leave he could'nt come and said i'd have to wait until the snow cleared. I was in tears, remembering holding my son and telling him how much i loved him and always will, after that the nurses took him away and was told that it was best i no longer looked after him because of the attachment.

I really no not know where i go from here, i think if my son continued our relationship then i would of told my parents, but as he no longer wants contact then i feel its not worth all the upheaval, to tell my mum that actually i am a grandmother and she's a greatgrandmother to 2 boys, but will never see them.........no, like i said to LA, i will let sleeping dogs lie. I am not somebody that will interfere, i do have urges sometimes, like when i think i'd like to know my son's A.mum because she has been so honest about my son's adoption from an early age and that she gave him his orgianl birth certificate. I think maybe she would of liked to have known about me too, or maybe not? As for his A.dad, i just wanted to see if i could find his grave and to visit him (in secret if you like) just to say "thankyou" for giving my son the best possible upbringing and that i am proud of the young man he has become.

I am still torn in so many ways, my feelings and thoughts change, with the what if's and should i's.......a battle that i will never win, i lost it the day i gave my son up for adoption.

The ultimate price i have to pay for the rest of my life.
cleo
 
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby ladyarcher70 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 10:53 pm

Just reading back, Cleo, as I wanted to check your son's age......34.....it's really odd that your parents were so obdurate over your pregnancy ......your son is the same age as the youngest of my three sons, who was 34 in Feb....... obviously I am a lot older than you, and was 39 when I had him ....... but we were by no means in the 'dark ages' of illegitimate births....... when I had my first son, who is 48 today.....then it certainly was still the 'dark ages', I have posted before about the awful treatment that another girl was given in the same cottage hospital at the same time I was there in 1968 ...when I was married to my first husband.......... but you had your son in the early 80s .... my eldest daughter who is nearly 38, has two children without marrying either of their fathers.....her boys are 8 years apart, and she was engaged each time.......and, in our view, mercifully, did not marry either of the lads.......both nice enough lads, and one still in the family as he eventually married her sister ...... but neither of them was right for our eldest daughter, nor she right for either of the lads.........a

A few months before I had my eldest son, i.e. 48 years ago, my sister-in-law became pregnant, she was turned out of the house by her father .....she went to live with her boyfriend's mother......she and her boyfriend married, and have been totally successfully married ever since ...... her father never forgave her either ....... she was half way through her nursing training at the time, so was not as young as you .......ironic, that she was turned out, and yet her brother, to whom I was properly married with the full Church and white frock 'do', was not turned out when he left me with two young boys aged 2 and 3, and he had run off with another woman, who also left her two young children, one of whom was adopted........a lot of mixed values there.....

... I can understand the shock of a parent worrying about a very young daughter who is pregnant........ but by the 1980s the 'out and never darken my door again.....' frame of mind was surely over ...........except perhaps amongst a very religious community......... all most parents in the 80s would do normally, would be to support a daughter ...............I think a lot of it has to do with some men not being at all comfortable with the idea of their daughters having a sex life... .and for some men this never resolves itself, even when their daughters are older....... however, all fathers will have known fifteen year old girls, when they were fifteen year old boys .......and experience is the only real cure for curiosity ......and we have all been fifteen years old.......

LA
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby cleo » Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:12 pm

Hello LA

Yes my son is 34 and yes the early 80,s one would of thought it was more 'common' to be accepted if you got pregnant, but sadly was not the case in our household.

My parents are not people of the church, but my dad is very down to earth, pragmatic in a way. I do not know why they were the way they were at that time but i guess with me being the eldest i should of set an example or i should of known better!!! I really cannot answer to be honest.

I question myself most days on what i have done so wrong in this life to be treated in such a way. The only person who has stuck by my side and gave me a helping hand is my husband, without whom i may never of made it this far. But then again i never thought i would get over the rejection of my son, yet, with time, its getting easier.

I'm not sure how i feel about him these days, i guess i feel let down and used, but seeing how i have changed these past couple of years, i think its best he doe's not see me, by this i mean my face has sagged, i am no longer my smiley happy self, i tend to keep myself to myself now and spend alot more time with my dogs.

I must admit LA when i read about your family history which is well complicated, how on earth can i have so much trouble with just my parents to start with, and then my son...is it so hard to try and be nice and get along, like you said in one of your replies to me, its not like he had the excuse of dying he could easily throw me a bone, and just give me snippets of news about his children.

Again, do i have the right to call them my grandchildren? I have done a FB page for when they get older and hope that one day i can share everything with them for example the photos i come across very rarely when my son puts one up....oh yes his girlfriend has now closed her FB page, i do not know why of course but tried to find her this week and her page is closed down. Not that she put anything up as like my son its all closed unless they put something on 'public'.

Anyway, it doe's not change anything for me, my feelings are sometimes so complicated i do not know how i feel, or how i should feel?!! All i ever wanted was a little bit of happiness, just to have my son acknowledge that i do have feelings too, i am not a green eyed monster.

I wonder if he ever thinks about his actions towards me, i know he's a busy person but just wonder sometimes....oh dear, its funny how we go back into the same routine as before, in a slightly different way, but like turtle even though i know where i stand i can draw the line, but there's always a glimmer of hope..just in case.....although i feel deep down that i am grasping onto a slippery rope.

I'm not sure if i am making sense again, its not always easy to write how i feel, i do not have a way with words, i wish i did, then maybe i would not be in this mess today.
cleo
 
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby sylvie 1 » Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:23 pm

LA, just a little note here on dates and attitudes to unmarried pregnant girls.

I had my son in the late 70s. Whenever I went to the hospital for a pregnancy check up, I was loudly and pointedly called 'Mrs' by the receptionists - despite being clearly 16 years old and with my mum.

Six years later, my sister gave birth to her child in hospital. She wasn't married, although she was with her child's father. No-one in authority blinked an eye that she was unmarried, and she certainly wasn't addressed as 'Mrs'.

Families are like odd ecosystems unto themselves, with their own laws. So often on 'Long Lost Family' you hear of fathers who simply rejected their pregnant daughter, often forcing an adoption to happen by making it impossible, especially back then when there was so little help outside the family, for the girl to keep her baby.

My own story was different. There was already an adoption within our family. Like suicide, this normalised what was, in fact, not normal at all.
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Re: Athensrunners Blog

Postby ladyarcher70 » Fri Apr 01, 2016 4:29 pm

Hi Sylvie ....... sorry not to reply sooner........I have had, and am still having such an incredibly busy March that I have hardly looked at any 'proper' sites for ages........just a brief check through fb and emails ...... and making the odd comment on the gardening site that I like to keep an eye on......

Isn't it funny how we react to being addressed......I had my eldest daughter, first child of my second marriage in October 1978 ...... and I took...., and still do take....., great offence, to being addressed by my Christian name by receptionists and in clinics etc.....this was just using my Christian name you understand, not even adding a Surname .......... interestingly, living now in mid Wales, our local GP surgery staff always use Mr and Mrs ....though on the reception desk when you 'sign in' with so many Davies and Jones and Williams, they do have to check a Christian name, and address to make sure they have the right Williams etc....

For many years now, if 'called' using just my Christian name, I ignore the call ...... and if they persist, I will say 'were you calling Mrs. B.......?'

LA
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